Autistic Adults: Our Diverse Sexual Orientations

Autistic Adults: Our Diverse Sexual Orientations

June 7^th, 2021

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Welcome everyone to Today’s Autistic Moment: A Podcast for Autistic Adults by An Autistic Adult. My name is Philip King-Lowe, the owner, producer, and host; and I am an Autistic Adult.  Thank you so very much for listening.

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I am a double rainbow man because I am Autistic and gay.  I came out as gay two times in my life. The second time I came out in 2008, I made myself two promises.  The first promise was that never again would I allow any church community to determine what kind of gay man I should be. The second promise was that never again would I let any LGBTQIA+ individual determine what religion I should or shouldn’t practice and/or what stereotypes I should associate myself with.  Most bars were too loud and crowded. Most of the time when I went to parties or events, I would find a corner to be alone and away from the overcrowded noisy spaces.  Jason and I are proud Episcopalians, and members of St. Mark’s Episcopal Cathedral in Minneapolis. I have a vocation as a Benedictine Anchorite Monk and a religious name.  I am also known as Br. Anselm Philip King-Lowe, OSB.  Even at St. Mark’s, I have dealt with the challenges of well-intentioned, but uninformed intolerance and worship spaces that are overwhelmingly crowded and loud with no sensory safe spaces.  When I was diagnosed as Autistic in 2011, my challenges made sense. Over the past ten years, I have rediscovered who I am as an Autistic gay man.  I have also met some amazing LGBTQIA+ Autistic people who have experienced their own marginalization in the LGBTQIA+ communities in terms of dating, sexuality, relationships, socializing and finding support.  In 2017 the International Society for Autism Research (INSAR) did a study and discovered that about 70% of Autistic participants reported being non-heterosexual.  There were as many if not more that identify as transgender with gender dysphoria, and as genderqueer and non-binary.  I have read many posts on various social media networks where Autistic Adults of diverse sexual orientations and gender identities struggle to find supportive communities from within LGBTQIA+ activist groups.  Many Autistic LGBTQIA+ individuals have said that finding accepting diversity among other Autistics who are of varied sexual orientations and gender identities/expressions is more fulfilling than those who are not Autistic.  As I was preparing to host this particular episode, I wanted to get some stories from other Autistic Adults who are part of the LGBTQIA+ communities to share with my listeners.  Heidi, Luke, and Benjamin are three Autistic Adults who identify with one or more of the diverse sexual orientations and genders. They are going to share some of their experiences with you on this episode of Today’s Autistic Moment.  I want to personally thank each one of them for being guests on my show. 

After this first commercial break, you will get to hear my conversations with Heidi, Luke, and Benjamin.  Stay Tuned.

Commercial Break I 

Philip King-Lowe
So Heidi, it's, it's June, which is gay pride month, in which we're honoring the LGBTQ communities. And as part of my work with Today's Autistic Moment, I want to get the perspectives of some some Autistic Adults who are LGBTQ. And so that's why you're here today. And I'm very grateful that you're here. Thank you for being on today. Um, and so I want to begin with my first question. What important information to Autistic Adults in our caregivers need to know about in terms of our diverse sexual orientations? And in this, I invite you to please tell us a little bit about what your experience has been like, as an Autistic person that identifies as you do.

Heidi Storm
Sure. Well, first of all, Philip, thank you very much for inviting me on to your podcast today. I'm excited to be part of Today's Autistic Moment. Like we said, my name is Heidi, my pronouns are she/her and they/them. And I, a 35 year old Autistic person living in St. Peter, Minnesota. I also identify as fat, white, disabled, queer, lesbian, gender queer, a non binary woman, and nebularomantic. My big interests are learning about being Autistic, disability advocacy, art, especially the scene that I'm working on with my good friend, Lacey, and hopefully doing some traveling when that becomes safer. Go on and carry on with the question, because I did get to prepare.  So could you just repeat that question, please?

Philip King-Lowe
Fine, no problem. What important information to Autistic Adults and our caregivers need to know about in terms of your experience, as an Autistic, lesbian, individual. And what maybe that's been like for you, what are some things? What are some information you might want to share with our listeners?

Heidi Storm
Even though I've been living these identities for my whole life, I feel pretty new to them. It's been just over a year since I was able to confirm that I'm Autistic with ADHD. In that time, I've been applying that new information throughout all aspects of my life. For me personally, knowing that I'm Autistic, helps me understand that I'm not doing anything wrong in the way I understand my gender and sexuality, but rather that I struggle with some of the social aspects of gender and sexual identity.  In addition to those challenges of being a late diagnosed Autistic person, have complex trauma as a person in a conservative Christian environment that did not acknowledge the existence of queer or trans people. I need others to know that I might have anxieties and questions about dating, flirting, sexuality and gender don't seem to fit my chronological age, and that's okay. Honest and trustworthy support people. As an Autistic person with complex PTSD, I might not be able to assume that people are allies, to LGBTQ folks, I need people to specifically tell and show me that they support me as a queer and gender expansive person. I also need to point out that when I was trying to work at a job and to overcome my depression and anxiety by working, I was being pushed further into Autistic burnout, and left with no energy to explore my identities or to express myself in social settings. This causes tremendous distress, including suicidal ideation. I have benefited by having dedicated time to recover from burnout and get out of survival mode to access Disability Resources, although that is a process as I know you discussed earlier on the podcast. Um, I do live with marginalizations as a disabled queer person, and also a certain amount of privilege as a white college educated person, and native English speaker accessing supports. recovering from Autistic burnout has given me the audacity to say that building healthy relationships of all types is my goal. Starting with self relationships, positive connections  with support people who I have chosen friendships moving into other close relationships, such as romantic and sexual relationships.

Philip King-Lowe
Very good. Thank you for sharing that. Um, the second question I asked is, what are the barriers for Autistic Adults of all ages? You just named some of your barriers, Autistic burnout. You know, the identity identification issue. You know, accessing your support, switches, and understandable answer. In terms of dating and relationships, talk about what some of your barriers might be, especially from the standpoint of being an Autistic Adult, of a diverse sexual orientation?

Heidi Storm
Yeah, the first thing that came to mind is what we sometimes call black and white thinking, has given me some trouble. I spent quite a lot of time being concerned with questions of labels, like some of the things that I've thought about are is the goldstar lesbian thing real or who is and is not a lesbian? Can I be a lesbian who uses she her and they them pronouns? Can I be both non binary and a one? So there's like a lot of nuance that goes into labels, but unfortunately, it can be hard to capture that without interacting with people about those questions, a whole lot of people who are exclusionary, so that is a difficult thing. I also spent time feeling it was afraid to, I was like, I feel like I also spent time feeling afraid it was too late, come out and find community and really explore that. I felt aware of sort of generational gap, between  myself and other LGBT People my age who have had more access to LGBT community and socialization. I performed some labels or roles to extremes, hoping that would make me feel connected to other queer people. Um, I went through like a big, hyper fem phase. And it's something that I definitely enjoyed at the time, maybe even to the degree of a special interest, but it may also have looked out of place or like a caricature to other people. So I guess I'm saying that sometimes people give up fake it until you make it not worked for me. Um, learning that I'm Autistic, helped with my worries about not being a good enough queer person. And I started to find community when I worked less on fixing myself, I was able to communicate a lot of my authentic self concept by intake forms for my evaluation, not AuSM, actually, which is The Autism Society of Minnesota when I was looking for a diagnosis. And so I think that, um points to the insight that I needed to be asked really clear and specific questions, by some understanding people about how my gender and sexuality.  I'm sometimes able to communicate quite a lot on forms, or when people ask me direct questions, long before I can communicate the same things and unstructured conversation. So that that's a pretty specific communication need for me. But I think that other Autistic people might also relate to that. I would encourage people supporting Autistic people to consider their functional communication needs in conversations about gender and sexuality. Please don't assume that an Autistic person struggling to talk about their gender or sexuality is not interested in those areas of their life. I would encourage support people to offer Autistic folks, flexibility, and communication goods, like encourage folks that you're supporting, to write or show something related to the topic and start the the conversation there. Instead of paying people to go off script on topics that feel personal or emotional. Attending me AuSM support for LGBT+ Autistic Adults helps me start talking more about myself and about my experiences and hearing from other Autistic people helped me think more about what I would like and like where I like to be in life. I'm accessing groups and events online, has also been really important for me as a person living in a more rural area. I've even started a new LGBT+ support group locally for adults with disabling mental health conditions. You asked specifically about dating and dating is still a challenge for me. Dating apps are really intimidating.  Also meeting people and trying to sort out what category of my life they belong in is difficult. I think that's a topic that's come up in a few conversations with other Autistic people that I've had. Just moved to the cities is rather unhelpful because moving is hard. And this we don't deserve to vacate all of the queer people from rural areas. An area to try to describe, based on my interests, likes and dislikes after spending so much time in the mental health and medical systems being defined trauma and deficits. I feel  alot with the medical model in the last few years and describe myself in this way. And now that I want to try dating, I'm, I have to make a really big shift in the way I talk about myself.  I'm looking forward, I love the idea of talking about access needs with potential partners, we can really take pleasure in caring for accommodations our partners need, and advocating for our own access needs in relationships. I recently tried online sapphic speed dating through a social media, and I liked it quite a bit. Being on video with people is naturally a little bit awkward. So it makes me stick a little bit awkward in comparison.

Philip King-Lowe
Okay. That's all good. All right. Um, all right, and the last question, and is, What steps should Autistic Adults and our supporters take to advocate for our needs? And in this question, I'd like you to talk a little bit about what are some ways that you may have found to advocate for yourself that you have found have been, have worked for you that might help other Autistic Adults with diverse sexual orientations consider advocating for themselves, what are some thoughts you have there?

Heidi Storm
For people supporting Autistic Adults in discovering and articulating their genuine sexuality, it's important to keep in mind that we are actual complex adults who may have a lot of formal and cognitive information. You may study things about gender and sexuality quite a lot before becoming able to say how we feel about them or what we really want. At the same coming out and coming to accept gender and sexuality is a personal and emotional process. And we need compassionate support at spaces where we don't have to worry about using the right words or expressing feeling like tears or adolescence in some ways. It's so important to have compassion for people who are moving through at the same times coming out what comes from direct experiences of abuse or neglect, or from broader community traumas such as growing up
in restrictive religions, purity culture, or other harmful system that disconnects us from our bodies and identities. I passionately believe that full of meet accessible trauma informed and scientifically accurate sexuality, education and resources, stick language around dating and relationships, and sexuality related things is incredibly unhelpful to Autistic people. And we might use language that sounds dry, or scientific to express our ideas because we want to feel like we're being really clear. And it's important to find people who, who can accept that we struggle with kind of communicating things that are personal or that are new for us. For me personally, but inner framework that I have for accepting myself as a fat person has given me resources for dealing with other marginalization or other new identities that might be struggling with.  I guess, I'm forgetting that when I could accept some part of my identity that I struggled with, I gained skills to repeat the process for other identities. I've also got a lot of appreciation for both of queer and trans writers, especially black indigenous and people of color.  And advocates who communicate about the overlapping is of disability sexuality and fat acceptance or body acceptance even. And so with, I spent a lot of time reading and in our with different mediums about, about sexuality and gender, and that's helped me a lot. Um, I also want to thank the Autistic community for welcoming my questions in the past year I've made a lot of connections to peers online, and even to Autistic parents of Autistic kids who have helped me understand things about myself. And I really appreciate that. 

Philip King-Lowe
Thank you to Heidi for talking with me today.  After this next commercial break, I will share my conversations with Luke and Benjamin with you. Stay Tuned.

Commercial Break II

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Welcome back.  I am so excited that you are listening to this installment of Today's Autistic Moment.  Now, let us hear from Luke and Benjamin regarding their stories of living as Autistic Adults with Diverse Sexual Orientations.

Philip King-Lowe
So Luke, thank you very much for accepting my invitation to interview. I am looking forward to publishing this particular episode and celebration of LGBT Pride Month.  I want information and some stories about what other LGBTQIA people have experienced as Autistics. And so I feel that having you and the other two guests will help me share that information. So um, so the first question I want to ask you is; What important information do Autistic Adults and our caregivers need to know about in terms of your experience, as an Autistic Adults of your sexual orientation?

Luke Zenker
There's extra layers of intersectionality that we have to deal with, that Autistics with only the diagnosis of Autism have to deal with. And that's pretty much the case with anybody who has two or more, you know, intersectional, oppression labels. And anybody with one too. Every person is unique. So any, any individual Autistic, I mean, it's a cliche, but any individual Autistic that you meet is individual in their experience and thoughts and opinions and needs, special needs, if you will.  And yeah, there's just very unique things that Autistics who are also in the LGBTQ+ community have to deal with in terms of deciphering their identity in terms of rationalizing or justifying their role between the two, because the two communities are separate. But then there's people in between the two communities that have to have their own unique, unique journeys between the two communities. And yeah, that's pretty much the case with anybody really, they have to rationalize their intersections between faith between community between minority markers, ethnic markers, things like that.

Philip King-Lowe
Those are good answers. Um, what has your journey been? More or less, like in terms of socializing, dating, relationships, finding your social circles and so on and so forth? Um, give us just a little bit about what what your journey has been like, as you've accepted your sexual orientation identity and being Autistic. Give me a little bit of an idea about what that's been like for you.

Luke Zenker
Um, well, I was diagnosed with a, on the spectrum pretty young in preschool. My mom is a pharmacist, and she knew things in the medical world, and disability world, because she was highly educated. So I have the privilege, sorta, it's definitely a privilege, but it comes with its own, its own unique challenges. But it took me, so I had the label pretty young. But I didn't really accept the label until maybe I had a good case manager after high school. There were periods of my childhood where, where I accepted it or identified that way. But in general, I wanted to try to fit in, I never succeeded in that, really. But I always wanted to try to fit in, but I was always very different from other people and my quirks and ways of doing things, ways of presenting myself. So I had a good case manager.  I went to, I went to a program called Transitions Plus immediately after high school, because the powers that be in the school and parents system decided I wasn't ready for college.  And that was probably true. So I went to a transition program. That was mostly people really on on the spectrum, I would say. And, yeah, I had a good case manager named Paul who kinda who was who was going to college for to be an Autism specialist, who was urging me to accept the diagnosis more, and I had a therapist that I started seeing, when I was 17, who also happened, I found out later to be queer. I started embracing the fact that I was queer when I was maybe 16. I had seedlings of it sprouting when I was maybe 15. I mean, I always had attractions to to other boys, um, and inclinations to do things that girls wanted to do. So I was always had. So I guess, that that to say I've always had, I've always been queer, but I didn't really find language about it till I was 13. And I didn't really start accepting it till I was 15. And I didn't really, really start coming out until I was 17. So my therapist helped me come to terms with my Autism and my and my queer identity. I lived in a suburb, Eagan. And my parents are kind of independents. But that still didn't make it easy. When I started coming out to them, they were not on board with that at the time. But they've come to accept it. So it's just been a long journey of dealing with other people's perceptions and, and sculpting, rationalizing and justifying the pieces of the story that came together to turn it into a narrative so I can tell a sort of cohesive story about when I started really coming out when I was 20. That was when I was homeless. Because my parents, and I started having some serious disagreements when when I started really coming out.

Philip King-Lowe
Yeah, okay, um, you're crossing into some barrier matters, which is good, because I always crossed into my second question anyway. Which is always what are the barriers for Autistic Adults of all ages. And I hear you talking a lot about some of the barriers that you have faced the barriers that the barriers that you're talking about are things like, you know, coming out, which is always challenging. But, um, do you have anything to talk about any barriers with how you have or have not been accepted by the LGBTQ communities in terms of being Autistic?

Luke Zenker
I've had, I've had a unique challenges in both the LGBTQ community and the Autism community with accepting for either of the, of the identities for in the Autism community for identifying as queer, and in the queer community for identifying as Autistic in both communities, there's individuals who, who aren't informed about the other might even be ignorant about the other.  Every community has, I mean, every person has prejudice, you know, just because you're from just because you're a minority and oppressed minority doesn't mean you're progressive.  It's what I've learned throughout all that. So I don't want to I don't want to say that either community has necessarily had unique bigotries in that regard.

Philip King-Lowe
Yeah. Yeah. What has been dating, what has been dating and maybe trying to create relationships been like for you?

Luke Zenker
Um, a lot of trial and error. I use services, I've used services such as fetlife. OK, Cupid. meetup.com. And The Autism Society of Minnesota, and they're in their adult support group. To meet people as well as honing my social skills a little bit with, with my therapist never tried to cure Autism, but just trying to exist in the world. That's not Autstic. Right. Although that's, that's where some of the difficulties come in. Because sometimes therapists have their own ideas. And just because they're a good therapist, doesn't mean they're good and everything so right.

Philip King-Lowe
Right. Yeah. And I would say that I'm one of those barriers for me too, has been just learning how to develop a good self image about being Autistic as well as being gay, or bisexual, bisexual or other other things. You know, I personally have found it very difficult to socialize within the LGBTQ communities, because for example, I am not someone who likes the bars or the big crowds, or I don't, I don't. So those are things that I have found kind of difficult. What about you?

Luke Zenker
Yeah, sensory wise. There's a lot of things like that. And in the queer community, in the queer community and the kink community. There's definitely barriers for Autistics when it comes to sensory friendly experiences. Because the queer community is so centralized in bars and clubs and places where, where it's allowed, and very, very stimulating in many sensory regards. And I've heard similar things from other Autistic weirs in that regard too.

Philip King-Lowe
I agree. All right, my, my last question is always what important steps should Autistic Adults and our supporters take to advocate for our needs? For for what to advocate for our needs, and in this in this kind of a question, I would ask you to maybe think about some ways that you have advocated for yourself that have worked well. Maybe some ways that have not worked so well. Maybe some things you've learned as you've been advocating for yourself.

Luke Zenker
What I've learned is that no matter where we go, non autistics are not going to understand me.  So I always am just prepared, honestly, for something to go wrong.  And for me to have to explain why go silent when, when, or look like Piglet when I'm, when I'm being confronted with something and need to be alone to process, or when or why I repeat certain things or rock back and you know, I'm getting specific but I just have to, I'm lucky to be sort of an extroverted Autistic. So in the right context, I am able to be very loud, and confrontational about what my needs and about my specifics and self advocacy, it just, it just sometimes it does look pretty, it doesn't feel pretty. It's not pretty. You do you have to be sensitive to other people's needs when it comes to self advocating, especially when it comes to conflict mediation that sometimes arise because people don't understand your Autism. I've dealt with a little bit of that was a particular person I'm working with right now. Yeah. It just comes down to self advocacy and being willing to take up space and make noise. It's I mean, it sounds like cliches, but the you know, cliches develop for reasons.

Philip King-Lowe
If you were to find yourself in the presence of someone who is Autistic, and or, you know, trying to work through the issues with their sexual orientation, whatever that sexual orientation might be, can you think of anything that you might say to that person that may be of help to them?

Luke Zenker
Be persistent. Know that you're going to fail in the endeavors. But that getting out there and finding your people. It's not a comfortable process and trying to put yourself out in the world and stretch your self, you got to stretch yourself, then sometimes as a therapist, just to say, be willing to fail, and know that you're going to fail at times. And when it comes to accepting your sexual orientation, I think the world's a bit more open about that, then, at least in America, it's more open about that than it has been in the past. So generally speaking, you know, you got to consider your own safety within whatever community and space you live in, but absolutely, but, but getting out getting out there and being who you are, and and advocating for yourself. Is all it's worth it in the end. Even if you have you're gonna have bad experiences. And you just gotta, you just got punched through that. 

Philip King-Lowe
Okay. Those are the answers. Okay, Luke, thank you for being on today.

Luke Zenker
Yeah, thank you. 

Now let's talk with Benjamin

Philip King-Lowe
So Benjamin, thank you for being on an episode of Today's Autistic Moment. Heidi, Luke, and you are my three individuals that I'm interviewing about the subject of our diverse sexual orientations. In honor of LGBTQ Pride Month.  And so I am very interested in getting your perspectives from your experiences and what you want to share with the listeners. So let's get right down to it. And I'll ask you my first question. What important information do Autistic Adults and our caregivers need to know about in terms of your experiences as a man who is gay and Autistic?

Benjamin Robinson
I think what they have to understand is that we have feelings. We have emotions, we are very empathetic, we understand what's going on. We're not stupid idiots in a sense of stando trying to figure out stuff, we want to have relationships, you know?  We want to be with people, and well, you know, we're human beings, we all want to be loved. We all want to be supported and we all want to be in relationship we may not be fully verbal or nonverbal, whatever it is. We all communicate that love is very different ways to communicate it.

Philip King-Lowe
That's a great answer. Thank you for sharing that. Give us some information as to what your your personal experiences may be like as you as you've come to terms with your sexual orientation, and some of the challenges you've experienced as an Autistic person.

Benjamin Robinson
Well, I think I've had challenges like multiple challenges but a lot of my challenges have to do with, I'm still get to deal with every day but is dealing with feeling good about myself. My self worth.  How do I feel about myself? I've been working with somebody I know personally, sort of a coach kind of a guy, been helped me with a lot of with that this year.  And bringing myself out of past shame, guilt around who I am, you know. Maybe to express who I am and what I want to do and how I want to live my life. You know, in Instead of freedom, I've spent a lot of my dating life, not trusting in relationship or being relationship people who were not trustworthy, or just stuff like that. And now I just want to sort of move past that and begin to really expand and open my heart up to people who want to love me for who I am. But I also want to love myself and be able to be, you know, independent from that kind of thing. And where, you know, where we can be, I mean, like I said, been a bit of a hardship, but it's a lot of it is, you know, taking it too personally or not understanding. I was trying to get into the rules of dating. Like being too afraid to ask these questions like, what is the relationship?  Is what what are we we just friend?  Are we going to be that way just going, and then it gets complicated later on. It's like, now what happened? When all that now what happens stuff is, I either misinterpret it, they misinterpret it, or they go away, and I blame myself for them going away when a lot of it is not my fault they went away, it just happened.  The natural progression of, "Oh, I don't like this person anymore," or example,when my last serious relationship, like, I was in it, and it's like, I don't see myself with this person full time. And when you get that way, it's like, you know, well, they were just very one sided, where I wasn't getting my needs met. I don't like that kind of relationship, because it just feels like I'm putting all my into this, and there's nothing coming out of it.

Commercial Break III

Future Shows

There are some great new shows coming up as Today’s Autistic Moment begins our first Summer Season.

On June 21^st join me and Enzi Tanner as we talk about Autistic Adults: Our Diverse Gender Identities.

Be sure to listen to Autistic Adults and Financial Planning on July 5^th with my guest Andrew Komarow.

Nicola Whiting is my guest to talk about Autistic Adults: Media Portrayal or Betrayal? Episode will be published on July 18^th. 

On August 7^th I will publish the episode Autistic Adults and Gaslighting. My guest is Christa Holmans who is known as the NeuroDivergent Rebel.

Finally, Dr. Theresa Regan, a Neuropsychologist and Certified Autism Specialist returns to talk about Autistic Adults and Communicating with Medical Professionals on August 23^rd.

Thank you for listening to Today’s Autistic Moment.

Philip King-Lowe
You've already kind of crossed into my second question, which is usually the case, but, um, what are the barriers for Autistic Adults of all ages? When it comes to diverse sexual orientations, and I hear you, talking about some of those already. Because what I hear you talking about is, is dating and the creation of relationships, understanding what's happening in those relationships, communicating what's happening in those relationships. Um, what are some of the barriers that you have found for yourself, um, that you might want those who are listening to, to hear about?

Benjamin Robinson
Some of the barriers include, and you and I have talked a little bit about this, you know, just contacted.  Boundaries and barriers. The idea the idea of asking me what I didn't know what I wanted before, but now I kind of gotten older, I know. Asking us what we want. Because you can, you know, do a one night stand and be fine. But I do know who I am. I'm very deep and compassionate and very, you know, sensible, but also, going really, really slow with us. Some of us have had past stuff that we're dealing with. And I think that, you know, one of the biggest deals is go slow. Don't think we're stupid, and dumb, give us a chance to show it. You know, it's gonna take a while, like, you know, I mean, I want it to be friendship, but then slowly intact, but it's also knowing that we have self worth too and not just your side of the story, and that we will understand you if you understand us.

Philip King-Lowe
Those are great answers. My third question to you is, what are some steps that Autistic Adults and our supporters need to take to advocate for our needs? And as part of this question, I invite you to think of some ways that you may have advocated for yourself in any given situation regarding your sexual orientation, and being Autistic, that you have found to be helpful to you. Or if you've even had one where where you could have done better and you really learn from it.

Benjamin Robinson
In a situation where I could have done better, there's a couple of situations at work where I could have been a lot more stronger in my voice about, you know, the abuse, I took up, not the emotional abuse, but just picking my voice in a job site where it's like, I could have said, I'm Autistic, I could use some help. But you're not helping you're just adding more to my, you know, stress. And I think sometimes I get really loud, like, you know, when I do Autism presentations, when I do interviews and talks, that really helps me reflect who I am. The poetry I do, the the writings, the you know, the videos I do. Everything I do is to help me just let it all out. You know, in a way that's expressing. Am I getting better at it? Yes. And I'm hoping to do more stuff, like be more open, more, you know, more talking about how subjects that we need to talk about sometimes. And create a space where younger generations and older generations can go, "Well I have that feeling too." "How do I expect that feeling like?" Well, here's your it's your job to do it.  And however that is and going back to that one piece of the puzzle doesn't fit everybody. You know, not everybody can do poetry, not everybody can do leading, not everybody can talk not everybody. So you need to like I always say kick off. I'm just joking. Just anybody out take out that education, Autistic lenses for two seconds and go. You know, I read the I read the studies, but take off those lenses for a second and go "Okay, what is this truth in front of me, right now with this kid." He needs somebody to listen to him. She or she needs a space than the nonverbal. What do they need me to hold their hand for a second? They need this in this moment right now. And they don't need me to psychoanalyze the heck out of it right now. And it's just, that's my answer is that you need to sometimes take off those lenses. And it's hard. I can't do it all the time. But take off the lenses. Because I was kids and go, what do they need? Like now? They need me not to be scientific and look at books, and research and data. They need me just to be here holding their hands or just talking to them, telling them to take a deep breath.

Philip King-Lowe
Yeah, it's basically learning to see, um, Autistics as people not necessarily a pathology?

Benjamin Robinson
Yeah, it's one of the things was a couple years ago, I use a story where I was driving up to one of the camps, I worked at. And I was reading one of the data books, one of the research books, you know, because I used to do that, and I stopped reading it, because I just felt like, we'll be into like, what, like little guinea pigs like, Whoa, compared to normal people who's normal, and I stopped reading those books, because I couldn't take it anymore. I still read up to the book to read books, mostly by people by Autism who have mothers. But it's still hard because you're not, you know, I understand my own story from somebody else's who has been through that whole process before. So we started data books didn't help me because, you know.

Philip King-Lowe
Okay, those are all good answers. Okay, well, thank you very much. 

Transcribed by https://otter.ai 

Today’s Autistic Community Bulletin Board

Autism Career Pathways invites you to enroll in their summer course Cultivating Autistic Entrepreneurship.  This ten-week course will begin on June 18^th.  Classes will be held every other Friday from 4-6pm PST.  This course is for neurodivergent adults wanting to explore and build self-employment, Autistic youth, and their parents.  Go to the very bottom of the Autism Resource Links page on todaysautisticmoment.com and click on the button Cultivating Autistic Entrepreneurship Course to review the syllabus and to register.

Spaces are still available to join other Autistic Youth and Adults in one any of the four Summer Recreation Sessions offered by The Autism Society of Minnesota in June, July, and August.  Visit places like Silverwood Park, the Bakken Museum, the Minnesota Zoo, Walker Arts Center, Minnesota History Center, the Science Museum of Minnesota, Long Lake Regional Park, and the Wood Lake Nature Center.  Go to ausm.org to register.

The form is now opened to apply to present a breakout session at the 2021 Virtual Autistic Community Summit on September 18^th. Submit your application to be a presenter by July 2^, 2021.  Suggested topics include Literature and arts from Autistics. Navigating and self-directing support services. Managing interactions with medical providers. How to write a waiver.  Meaningful inclusion, especially for those with higher support needs. Hiring and training staff.  Person centered planning across the lifespan.  Autism and mental health.  Autism pride and self-acceptance. Autism and intersectionality, including race, age, gender, sexuality etc. Shut downs and meltdowns. Emotional regulation. Managing medical interactions. Masking.  For more information contact Zephyr James at 651-647-2081 ext. 23 or send an email to zjames@ausm.org. 

Remember you can always send me an email to PKLowe@todaysautisticmoment.com.  todaysautisticmoment@gmail.com. Please follow Today’s Autistic Moment on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, and LinkedIn. 

Thank you for listening to Today’s Autistic Moment: A Podcast for Autistic Adults by An Autistic Adult.